The Tango-L mailing list archive
Digest from 19 Sep 2000
to 20 Sep 2000
Reply-To: Discussion of Any Aspect of the Argentine Tango <TANGO-L @MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
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Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 03:00:31 -0400
Sender: Discussion of Any Aspect of the Argentine Tango <TANGO-L @MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
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Subject: TANGO-L Digest - 19 Sep 2000 to 20 Sep 2000 (#2000-254)
There are 9 messages totalling 331 lines in this issue.
Topics of the day:
1. Irresponsibility of Milonga Organizers
2. Tango Shows (2)
3. Jan , I keep thinking on your comments about artistic tango
4. Jan, I am still thinking about your comments
5. FW: Irresponsibility of Milonga Organizers
6. Denver Weekend Photos
7. Show Tango
8. Cuarteto Argentino
Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 18:37:22 +0900
From: astrid <astrid @RUBY.PLALA.OR.JP>
Subject: Re: Irresponsibility of Milonga Organizers
Original Message -----
From: astrid <astrid @ruby.plala.or.jp>
To: Stephen P Brown <Stephen.P.Brown @dal.frb.org>
Sent: Tuesday, September 19, 2000 1:10 AM
Subject: Re: Re: Irresponsibility of Milonga Organizers
>
> In the absence of the sadly defunct Tangopolis worldwide list of
> local contacts, friends, inquiries to Tango-A, and contacts listed on
local webpages are the best possibilities.
>
In case this is of interest to anyone:
For Germany I found the www.cyber-tango.com links very reliable, he has
international links too and an English version.. The Berlin list is
completely updated.
When I went to Friedrichshafen last year I called the phone number in
Konstanz, and she said, yes, they dance tonight. When I asked for directions
she offered to pick me up at the house I was staying because it was on her
way. She took me home too. The next day I got a call from somebody at that
milonga and was invited to a tango festival in another city.
Now these were small towns. In Berlin I was turned down at a practica
because I did not bring a man and they never change partners ! If you want
to dance at a school in Berlin you have to at least give them a few days to
arrange a partner for you. Women would do better to bring a partner to the
milongas, too, because of this attitude, I would say.
Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 19:03:47 +0900
From: astrid <astrid @RUBY.PLALA.OR.JP>
Subject: Re: Tango Shows
> I ask you, do you want to limit yourself to the eight count basic,
> walking, and ochos FOREVER?! Do you not want to broaden your repertoire?
> Do you not want to be creative and innovative and make interesting new
> steps and combinations? Do you want always to just do the steps exactly
> as you learned them in class and never change them?
Dear Jan,
I enjoyed reading about your passion for dancing tango.
I just wonder whether you know one thing :
It is not so easy to do the eight count basic. Of course, anyone can
memorise and do those eight steps but to do them the way they ought to be
done is altogether another story, and can take a couple of years to master
and many people never do.
One single tango step, deliberately slowed down and full of sustained energy
feels more exciting than a whole array of sloppy barridas, off center
calecitas, egg shaped giros and badly timed boleos.
Have you walked your miles ? Have you done those thousands of ochos to get
the right spin in your waist ? Have your learned to hold your partner the
way a milonguero does ?
Then we can talk.
Astrid
Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 06:55:50 -0600
From: Tom Stermitz <stermitz @CSN.NET>
Subject: Re: Tango Shows
> > I ask you, do you want to limit yourself to the eight count basic,
>> walking, and ochos FOREVER?! Do you not want to broaden your repertoire?
>> Do you not want to be creative and innovative and make interesting new
>> steps and combinations? Do you want always to just do the steps exactly
>> as you learned them in class and never change them?
>
>Dear Jan,
>I enjoyed reading about your passion for dancing tango.
>I just wonder whether you know one thing :
>It is not so easy to do the eight count basic. Of course, anyone can
>memorise and do those eight steps but to do them the way they ought to be
>done is altogether another story, and can take a couple of years to master
>and many people never do.
Then it takes another 2 years to eradicate that damn pattern.
From what I have seen, learning the 8CB (w/DBS) slows down your
learning of social tango by 1 or 2 years. The reason for this should
be obvious. As an improvisational dance learning a pattern takes you
in the opposite direction.
On the other hand a choreographed dance like fantasy tango, the 8CB
(w/DBS) provides one structure for memorizing your patterns.
This is more like "real" tango:
>One single tango step, deliberately slowed down and full of sustained energy
>feels more exciting than a whole array of sloppy barridas, off center
>calecitas, egg shaped giros and badly timed boleos.
>Have you walked your miles ? Have you done those thousands of ochos to get
>the right spin in your waist ? Have your learned to hold your partner the
>way a milonguero does ?
>Then we can talk.
>Astrid
See Cacho Dante's comments on tango:
http://www.tango.org/dance/teachers/Cacho.html
--
Tom Stermitz
stermitz @ragtime.org
http://www.ragtime.org/ragtime
http://www.tango.org/dance
Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 09:52:27 -0300
From: Alberto Gesualdi-SMC Argentina- HQ <adm @SMCAR.COM.AR>
Subject: Jan , I keep thinking on your comments about artistic tango
Dear Jan
I keep thinking about your comments.
It is ok for you to embrace artistic tango , if you feel it is what you was
waiting for your personal expression.
Another person of the list (Astrid) is quite well in her expression. The
eights are not monotonous, they are always different. It is a way to "walk"
the ball room.
If you season those eights with some pivots/swivel , you have a possibility
of movements in a 360 degree scope.
Let me told you a little story.We have in our school a young boy, he wanted
to do artistic tango. So he left the school, practice very hard, & was
really good.
He came back to the school the following year & asked to join again. He was
warmly received, since it was a very good guy.
But he came again with a little big problem. He could not dance freely, he
need a choreography for each music theme , othwerwise he could not be able
to move well. Moreover, since the female partner changed after each music
.he comment it was difficult for him to tune with the new partner .
But , at the end of the year, he made an excellent dancing in our closing
"milonga". He set free movements, season some parts with his skill ,dance
with different ladies . He was very happy .
"Now ", he said , "I understand how to dance on my own".
" I was Pinocchio before, a wooden muppet "
"Now I have a real heart "
Fortunately, Jan , tango music world is wide enough for you, for me, for the
ladies, for everyone who is in love with this music
Keep well
Alberto
Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 10:09:20 -0300
From: Alberto Gesualdi-SMC Argentina- HQ <adm @SMCAR.COM.AR>
Subject: Jan, I am still thinking about your comments
dear jan
I kept thinking about your comments.
I think that the most proper word for a male & a female , who met by chance
at a milonga , and dance the eights , and enjoy the dance, is
epiphany
You embrace your female partner as a little humming bird.
If you squeeze too much, she may die
If you squeeze too little, she may fly
Kind regards
Alberto
Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 07:58:30 +0200
From: Hangleiter Ralph <Ralph.Hangleiter @HYGIENE.SCA.SE>
Subject: FW: Irresponsibility of Milonga Organizers
Original Message-----
From: Hangleiter Ralph
Sent: Tuesday, September 19, 2000 7:58 AM
To: 'Stephen P Brown'
Subject: RE: Irresponsibility of Milonga Organizers
How to know who to contact locally?
Don't forget your other tango-friends travel, too.
So if you know in advance, why not try whether they
have already found a "good" local contact in that
region of the world. Works usually quite well for me.
Ciao
Ralph
Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 13:00:31 -0400
From: Phil Ferrigno <Phil.Ferrigno @MAPICS.COM>
Subject: Denver Weekend Photos
At http://www.tango-atlanta.com/places.html you will find photos of
Denver's recent Milonga at Cheesman park. Included are several shots of
the spectacular sunset.
Best regards,
Phil
Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 19:08:54 -0400
From: Larry Carroll <larrydla @JUNO.COM>
Subject: Show Tango
There is, of course, absolutely nothing wrong with show tango. It's a
beautiful art form, equal to ballet, flamenco, & all the other forms
of show dancing. Also, as Anton & others have pointed out, tango
wouldn't be danced outside Argentina at all if it weren't for all the
people who were inspired by show tango. And very few people inside
Argentina would be dancing it.
Nor is it wrong to use show tango on the dance floor. What's wrong is
to MISuse it.
This was most evident recently at the Sherman Oaks milonga put on by
Alexis White & his friends, a great evening celebrating the arrival of
Chicho & Lucia in Southern California for a month of classes.
Three-fourths of the way through Chicho & Lucia put on a terrific
performance, dancing two tangos, a vals, & a milonga.
Afterwards at least nine men were trying to do what they'd just seen -
& trying to do it on a crowded dance floor. It was so bad that I quit
dancing altogether, got a plateful of buffet, & sat the next hour
enjoying the food & dringk, & the tight dresses all the women were
wearing.
But what were Chicho & Lucia doing before & after the performances, on
the same crowded dance floor? Much the same they'd done while
performing, but much more compact, less dramatic, & completely safely
within the traffic flow.
Here's what the nine (or more) idiots & assholes were doing, in total
disregard of everything else, including the safety of their own
partners.
* Racing - very fast steps.
* Racing - very long steps.
* Stopping - for very long times, not just a second or two.
* Windmilling - very fast molinetes, with arms extended way out.
* Whiplash boleos - snapping women's legs in very fast arcs.
* Hard sacadas - forcing women's legs far out from their bodies.
* Squatting cortes - with man's & woman's legs extended across (not
along) the line of dance.
* And, of course, the ever-popular - walking backward against the line
of dance WITHOUT looking where they were going.
Many women dancing with these men probably thought they were terrific
- at least until they were hurt or hurt someone else. But the men
around these men were probably memorizing their faces for future
reference. I certainly was.
Larry de Los Angeles
http://home.att.net/~larrydla
Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 18:44:02 -0400
From: Daniel Saindon <gardien @TANGO.MONTREAL.QC.CA>
Subject: Cuarteto Argentino
Good evening
At 16:59 01-09-18 -0400, Luda and Gabriel asked:
>What does anybody know about this group, conductor bandoneonist Enrique
>Tellerias, with dancers and singers? They'll be in Montreal next Sunday,
>the 24th.
What you need to know about this event
is that it is organized by Victor Uribe
of Montreal.
Victor has united local talents,
musicians like the (very good) pianist J.M Gianelli
& dancers like Santiago & Mylena (of the Academy)
with the bandoneonist Enrique Tellerias who
will fly from Bs As (who we have never heard before)
and great Artists that are currently visiting Mtl
( like Hernan Oliva & Mariana ) to produce a Show
that will be presented in a very nice and modern
Concert Hall. (The Salle Pierre Mercure).
There is a significant financial risk in
undertaking such an Show on this scale. They
will need a strong support from the general public
to fill all the seats of the Salle Pierre Mercure.
The poster is nicely done. I sincerily hope
the event will be succesfull but personnally,
I would wait till the last minute to buy my ticket
to avoid the possibility of having to wait in line
to get a reimbursement...
Daniel Saindon
gardien @tango.montreal.qc.ca
End of TANGO-L Digest - 19 Sep 2000 to 20 Sep 2000 (#2000-254)
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