The Tango-L mailing list archive
Digest from 7 Jun 2000
to 8 Jun 2000
Reply-To: Discussion of Any Aspect of the Argentine Tango <TANGO-L @MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
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Date: Thu, 8 Jun 2000 03:00:53 -0400
Sender: Discussion of Any Aspect of the Argentine Tango <TANGO-L @MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
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Subject: TANGO-L Digest - 7 Jun 2000 to 8 Jun 2000 (#2000-156)
There are 7 messages totalling 304 lines in this issue.
Topics of the day:
1. La letra de "El Choclo"
2. El Choclo
3. Nice lines men tell women at the milongas in Bs.As. (2)
4. Rodolfo & Maria Cieri
5. Maria and Rodolfo Cieri Video
6. Rudolfo Cieri
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Date: Wed, 7 Jun 2000 15:41:51 +0200
From: Natarajan Balasundara <rajan @EMC.COM>
Subject: Re: La letra de "El Choclo"
Charles Roques wrote:
>
> re Dario's request for why "El Choclo" was titled thus. Supposedly Villoldo
> composed it while in a restaurant so he may have named it that because he was
> eating corn on the cob at the time. Titles don't have to be serious and
> profound so that sounds like as good an explanation as any :-).
According to 'http://www.hooked.net/~tangoman/elchoclo.htm',
the explanation given by the author himself is:
<quote>
The name had been decided by Villoldo, who named it El choclo, the ear
of corn, because "I loved it from the very first note,
and for me the ear of corn is the tastiest ingredient of the 'puchero',
a meat and vegetables stew ..."
</quote>
rajan.
Date: Wed, 7 Jun 2000 16:01:09 +0200
From: Natarajan Balasundara <rajan @EMC.COM>
Subject: Re: El Choclo
Deborah Holm wrote:
>=20
> I wish it was clear whether:
>=20
> The man killed his woman's lover; or
>=20
Possible -- he still loves his woman and thinks she
is innocent and possessed by the devil of a (wo)man
who has to be killed.
> The man killed his woman because she had a lover.
>
Also possible -- she is an evil woman who has deceived him
and has lead him astray and deserves to die.
=20
> This is interesting to me because I am a woman and
> I would like to know what to expect.
>
I suppose one should expect the unexpected--any author worthy
of reading has to have an ability to convince(and in poetry=20
confuse as well) the readers that the unexpected is the only=20
reasonable thing that could have happened -- not necessarily=20
by telling explicitly 'why' but by showing the sequence of=20
events that 'inexorably' leads to the unexpected end.=20
=20
> If I am to be killed because I am unfaithful to a man,
> then I need to know that.
>
Not in advance -- since anything could happen(as above).
But, for sure, once an event happens we would have a=20
better idea of what the *most likely* cause is if=20
something similar in the future. But if the same thing=20
happens in the future and we find out what we thought was=20
most likely to have caused it is not the one which caused=20
it, then, obviously we have to change our expectation what=20
is most likely to cause it in the farther future...one way=20
to do it -- a bayesian approach.
=20
> And, of course, I would be stricken with remorse if
> "my" man killed my lover, because my lover would
> be more important to me than "my" man. Right?
>
Upto you -- your choice. To each her own choice.
=20
> Please..... Explain....
This is just an opinion not to be confused with an=20
explanation. Besides, I am not sure an author has
to make explicit the reason as to *why* something=20
happend but just *what* happend or, more exactly, *what
could* happen -- just like a reporter -- except that=20
he is reporting the events that he himself is creating
but pretends that the events were just revelations=20
to him and he has no access to those faculties in=20
himself which revealed it to him(after all they spurng=20
out of the subconcious) and so has no way of explaining 'why'.
BTW, I used http://www.altavista.com/ to translate the=20
original posted by Ruddy Zelaya(since I know no spanish)=20
and it came out this way:
<tanslation>
Fu=E9 that night, that todavia me aterra, when it was mine,=20
played with my passion, and in the
duel until death, with whom it robbed my life,=20
my dagger gaucha, divided its heart, and they
called to me, choclo companion, I carved in the entreveros,=20
insurance and fajador, but a Chinese, poisoned my life,=20
and today I cry solo, with my tragic pain. Wanted Tango, old choclo
that it obstructs to me, with the caress of your notes so felt,=20
I want to die under I sing to sleep of your complaints,=20
singing my complaints, crying my pain.=20
</translation>
For sure, better than my ignorance -- although makes me=20
curious what the words 'chinese' and 'insurance' are=20
doing in there :-)
rajan.
Date: Wed, 7 Jun 2000 09:55:02 -0400
From: SERGIO <SERGIO @NCINTER.NET>
Subject: Nice lines men tell women at the milongas in Bs.As.
Frases lindas que dicen los hombres a las mujeres en las milongas de Buenos
Aires.
Nice lines men tell women at the Milongas in Buenos Aires.
"Ahora que baile con vos, ya me puedo ir, te juro, ya tengo la noche
hecha."
Now that I had the chance to dance with you, I can leave, I swear, my night
is complete.
"Mira que he bailado en mi vida, pero esto que siento con vos, es nuevo,
unico, nunca me paso."
I have done a lot of dancing in my life, but this feeling with you is new,
unique, I have never experienced anything like this before.
Date: Wed, 7 Jun 2000 10:22:17 -0400
From: Enrico Massetti <enrico @AAANETSERV.COM>
Subject: Rodolfo & Maria Cieri
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Rodolfo was a young gentleman in Buenos Aires, 20 years old, the best =
tanguero
"en el salon", all the girls were dying to be invited by him.
Maria was a young girl, she was 13 and had to be escorted by her mom, or =
some
other relative to attend the dances. She did not pay any attention to =
Rodolfo...
and he instead fell in love for her!
This is their true story, as Maria told me during a dinner in Venezia, =
Italy.
What is most amazing is that 47 years later this couple showed not only =
the
same ability to dance (perhaps even a better one after the years), but =
also the same=20
lively interrelationship that brought them together years ago.
I only met them once, but I feel I lost a longtime friend.
Enrico
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<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Rodolfo was a young gentleman in Buenos Aires, 20 =
years old,=20
the best tanguero</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>"en el salon", all the girls were dying to be =
invited by=20
him.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Maria was a young girl, she was 13 and had to be =
escorted by=20
her mom, or some</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>other relative to attend the dances. She did =
not pay any=20
attention to Rodolfo...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>and he instead fell in love for her!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>This is their true story, as Maria told me during a =
dinner in=20
Venezia, Italy.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>What is most amazing is that 47 years later this =
couple showed=20
not only the</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>same ability to dance (perhaps even a better one =
after the=20
years), but also the same </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>lively inter</FONT><FONT size=3D2>relationship that =
brought them=20
together years ago.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>I only met them once, but I feel I lost a longtime=20
friend.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=3D2>Enrico</FONT></DIV>
<DIV> </DIV></BODY></HTML>
=_NextPart_000_0029_01BFD06A.41E37640--
Date: Wed, 7 Jun 2000 16:56:07 +0200
From: Alexis Cousein <al @BRUSSELS.SGI.COM>
Subject: Re: Nice lines men tell women at the milongas in Bs.As.
SERGIO wrote:
> "Ahora que baile con vos, ya me puedo ir, te juro, ya tengo la noche
> hecha."
Ah shucks. I have trouble enough in Castillian, and now I'll have to
learn this "vos" instead of "Usted" stuff too before I can use these
nice lines (*)?
(*) I have a friend who lives in Barcelona with an Argentinean bandoneon
player/composer -- who insists on 'correcting' her when she uses
Castillian grammar :/. Well, I suppose Barcelona is neutral territory
wrt Castillia and South-America.
--
<disclaimer: these are my personal views, not always SGI's>
Alexis Cousein al @brussels.sgi.com
Systems Engineer SGI Belgium/Luxemburg
Date: Wed, 7 Jun 2000 13:55:23 -0500
From: Stephen P Brown <Stephen.P.Brown @DAL.FRB.ORG>
Subject: Maria and Rodolfo Cieri Video
Maria and Rudolfo Cieri were among the influential couples in the
rapid expansion of salon-style tango in the 1980s and 1990s. Maria
and the late Rodolfo were known for their incredibly fast and precise
footwork and style, as well as the musicality of their dancing. I did
not have the pleasure of seeing them dance in person but I have seen
and would recommend the instructional video they prepared for Bridge
to the Tango <http://www.bridgetothetango.com>
In the video, Maria and Rudolfo cover the basics of their style, some
intermediate figures, and some advanced turns. They integrate
adornments into many of their figures. In a departure from most
instruction, Maria discusses the woman's role in each figure, as well
as the dance as a whole. The video includes three performance
demonstrations and many short demonstrations. The instruction on the
video is valuable, but the visual record of their style is more than
worth the $40.
--Steve de Tejas
Date: Wed, 7 Jun 2000 16:44:25 -0700
From: Barbara Alexius <taitango @IO.COM>
Subject: Rudolfo Cieri
Dear Friends,
AT CITA 99 I, too, had the opportunity to experience Rudolfo and Maria, as
teachers and performers. What set them apart from any of the other masters,
for me, was the light in their eyes and in their expression of the dance. I
am feeling sad and, at the same time, very grateful.
End of TANGO-L Digest - 7 Jun 2000 to 8 Jun 2000 (#2000-156)
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