The Tango-L mailing list archive
Digest from 13 Jul 2000
to 14 Jul 2000
Reply-To: Discussion of Any Aspect of the Argentine Tango <TANGO-L @MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
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Date: Fri, 14 Jul 2000 03:00:44 -0400
Sender: Discussion of Any Aspect of the Argentine Tango <TANGO-L @MITVMA.MIT.EDU>
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Subject: TANGO-L Digest - 13 Jul 2000 to 14 Jul 2000 (#2000-192)
There are 4 messages totalling 235 lines in this issue.
Topics of the day:
1. Technique
2. The "scariness" of the abrazo (2)
3. Piropos from the milongas in Buenos Aires
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Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 11:38:09 +0200
From: Natarajan Balasundara <rajan @EMC.COM>
Subject: Re: Technique
Carlos Lima wrote:
> These may also attend week-end warrior camps where
> they are trained to talk more or less like this:
>
> Who are you miserable beginner, with just one year
> and a half of experience, if we can call your timid
> prancing experience at all --- a neophyte nowhere near
> mastering mere double back sacadas, let alone really
> advanced moves like the one-way 12 turn continuous
> giro combination --- who are you to have an opinion
> about what cool dancers like me, whom everybody
> admires, just look at me, should and should not do on
> the dance floor, and how much of it we are allowed to
> stake out for our own use? How dare you question our
> right to execute the, er, figures we like and, unlike
> you, took the trouble to learn, and to complete them
> without finding plodders like you in the prescribed
> path? See? I am looking at the studio mirror right
> now, and don t I look great? Unfortunately my partner
> is not really up to snuff, and seems not to be really
> with me on this. Look, here it goes, another double
> back sacada. It is already the fourth in this tango,
> and it has been playing for nary a minute. I do it
> between spin cycles, every time the music goes
> boom-boom, like this.
>
And, then, some of them return triumphantly from
these sessions and say with a peaceful poise:
"All the old masters learnt tango just by watching."
almost as if to suggest they too learnt it that way.
rajan.
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 08:59:20 GMT
From: ASTRID SATO <astridsato @HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: The "scariness" of the abrazo
>>... another, maybe even more frightening thing in Japan is apparently a
>>woman with personality...
>
>That particular characteristic in women unnerves a few men in other
>countries as well.
What I meant was just that, in the literal sense. Like a Japanese professor
once said:" Japanese hesitate to become a person in front of somebody."
Therefore the preoccupation with technique, getting everything right when
you copy a master, the perfectionism...So you don4t stand out in the group
because anything other than being formal might prove embarrassing. The head
silences the heart.
And, in a misogynist country like Japan, looking down the abysses in a
woman4s soul is frightening. The majority of the men here wants a silent,
obedient, politely smiling follower, nothing more than that. Of course there
are exceptions, otherwise I wouldn4t still be dancing.
But what is unnerving to a few men in other countries as well ? Are such
women difficult to lead for a mediocre dancer?
Or is it the general fear of the personal encounter?
It's pretty difficult
>to teach
>sensuality or how to hold another person warmly. Talk about scaring
>people!
Sensuality cannot and does not need to be taught because it has nothing to
do with technique or a certain posture, it just happens. Just like warmth
does. Pretending to be warm and sensuous would be distasteful.
What can be taught, however, is the kind of abrazo that makes a woman relax
and stop worrying about getting out of synch with her partner. (Our teachers
always say, a woman must not think while she dances.) A man that doesn4t
care about the woman, a man that worries too much about himself, a man that
expresses insecurity in his movements, hold and touch, never succeeds in
making a woman4s thoughts stop. He communicates tension and discomfort and
makes a woman wary.
A limp arm around my back and a hesitating touch is not only unappealing, it
also puts extra strain on me trying to keep my balance in the giro enrosque,
e.g..Of course, a firm, yet gentle embrace feels warm and possibly sensuous,
simply because the man is present in his embrace. But that is not the only
advantage.
A woman cannot follow without being very aware of the man. For a man it is
possible to "dance by himself" but not for a woman. But her awareness
shouldn4t be strained. It will impend her ability to dance well.
>>I think it takes close to a year of practising, before you can enter
>>blissful oblivion and the steps will just happen naturally, gliding along
>>with the flow of the music without a thought entering your mind.
>>That's when you can exalt... And it also takes a certain kind of spirit,
>
>I agree wholeheartedly about the spirit aspect, and as I stated once in the
>past on the List, this is probably the area of tango that eludes (or
>frightens) people the most.
I did not read your mail at that time. If people are so frightened of that
aspect, then why do they dance tango? What are they trying to do? I know
about the elusiveness, but isn4t it the longing for that state, that makes
dancing tango so addictive?
The dance simply can not be about physical
>technique
>alone unless a person's intent is to merely act tango while ignoring the
>question of emotion.
What point is there in "acting tango"? For simply being trendy,tango is far
too expensive, time- and energy consuming, I think. At least for somebody,
who is trying to become good at it.
So ,what I4m trying to say is that sensuousness, warmth, letting go of
mental preoccupation are the factors that facilitate dancing the tango.
"Acting tango", being scared of your partner, hesitating to go with the flow
are not only unnatural behavoiur, they also make you a poor dancer.
Astrid
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Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 17:25:28 -0300
From: Janis Kenyon <jantango @FEEDBACK.NET.AR>
Subject: Piropos from the milongas in Buenos Aires
Tito Palumbo, editor of Buenos Aires Tango, is asking for women to tell him
the lines men say in the milongas. He offers two milonga entradas for their
submissions. abatango @yahoo.com
The July issue supplement has some real gems (which I offer in my best
translation):
Tonight I won the lottery dancing with you, girl.
Give me your telephone so we can do a competition.
Princess, you don't know how long I've waited for this day.
I'm going to return to pay the entrada, because to have danced with you is
incredible.
Ah, you're not a Citroen, you're a Mercedes Benz.
_______
On a more serious note...
Homenaje a Los Milongueros por Marisa Galindo
- son quienes saben hacer la ronda
- son quienes tienen un oido musical increible
- son los que conocen cada orquesta y a sus cantores, y a veces te cantan
despacito al oido
- son quienes con poco despliegue coreografico producen un fuerte
intercambio de emociones y de placer; que a veces se transforma en extasis,
cuando desde el rol femenino, podes cerrar los ojos en una entrega total
- son suaves y precisos en la marcacion, marcan con todo el cuerpo
- cuidan a las mujeres para que no sean golpeadas
- bailan para el y para ella, no para el publico
- respectan al grupo evitando las figuras que son peligrosas en la pista:
ganchos, boleadas, etc.
- su ritmo, las variaciones ritmicas y sus pausas estan en contacto con la
musica, con la mujer y con los otros bailarines.
_________
Buenos Aires Tango is a free magazine with everything you need to know
during your visit in Buenos Aires about classes, milongas, special events,
shows, etc. Guia Trimestral (June/July/August 2000 now on sale) is another
good reference for classes, practicas, milongas, CDs, videos, tango on
radio/tv, etc. and is sold at kioscos for $2.
Date: Thu, 13 Jul 2000 23:07:57 -0500
From: Tom Ronquillo <tigrre @EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject: Re: The "scariness" of the abrazo
At 08:59 AM 7/13/00 +0000, ASTRID SATO wrote:
... in a misogynist country like Japan, looking down the abysses in a
>woman4s soul is frightening. The majority of the men here wants a silent,
>obedient, politely smiling follower, nothing more than that. Of course there
>are exceptions, otherwise I wouldn4t still be dancing.
>But what is unnerving to a few men in other countries as well ?
I was referring to the issue of women in other countries deviating from
traditional behaviors proscribed for women. These deviations could range
anywhere from a woman daring to have a strong opinion to a woman who wants
to share the lead in tango.
>>>I think it takes close to a year of practising, before you can enter
>>>blissful oblivion and the steps will just happen naturally, gliding along
>>>with the flow of the music without a thought entering your mind.
>>>That's when you can exalt... And it also takes a certain kind of spirit,
>>
>>I agree wholeheartedly about the spirit aspect, and as I stated once in the
>>past on the List, this is probably the area of tango that eludes (or
>>frightens) people the most.
>
>... If people are so frightened of that
>aspect, then why do they dance tango?
The spirit aspect that I was referring to is about intimacy within the
dance. Individuals occasionally desire intimacy but fear the vulnerability
associated with it. A three minute tango in close embrace is more intimacy
than some people experience in their everyday non-tango lives. Tango can
be at once thrilling and terrifying for these folks.
>What point is there in "acting tango"?
Fantasy: empty, lacking-in-intimacy life by day, romantic tango dancer by
night. Ego: step collectors on a quest to master the "chess of dance
games." Those are but two notions that immediately leap to mind.
>... sensuousness, warmth, letting go of
>mental preoccupation are the factors that facilitate dancing the tango.
>"Acting tango", being scared of your partner, hesitating to go with the flow
>are not only unnatural behavoiur, they also make you a poor dancer.
Time for you to move from Japan, Astrid. I think you are being wasted
there. You should consider moving to Leonardo's town and helping out at
the milongas he hosts. I understand he is encountering a shortage of
passion there.
El Tigre
End of TANGO-L Digest - 13 Jul 2000 to 14 Jul 2000 (#2000-192)
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