The Tango-L mailing list archive
Digest from 24 Apr 1999
to 25 Apr 1999
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Reply-To: Discussion of Any Aspect of the Argentine Tango
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Date: Sun, 25 Apr 1999 03:00:02 -0400
Sender: Discussion of Any Aspect of the Argentine Tango
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Subject: TANGO-L Digest - 24 Apr 1999 to 25 Apr 1999
There are 5 messages totalling 170 lines in this issue.
Topics of the day:
1. Sore feet
2. Tango Technique (2)
3. Right woman's heel height
4. Ithaca tango
Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 00:50:51 +0200
From: Helaine Treitman <treitman @GIOTTO.ORG>
Subject: Re: Sore feet
I agree with Garrit about changing shoes and getting a foot massage.
But as I wrote privately to Colette, as a beginner I used to suffer from
soreness on the balls of my feet until I learned to put my heels down. It
immediately solved the problem of soreness there, and helped my balance,
too - helped me find my axis so I put no weight on the leader . . .
I like to break the rule of putting no weight on the leader when it happens
that both partners are moved to lean into each other and it feels like
you're both taking energy from the ground and sending it up to your partner
while you receive their energy; you do it because it works for that dance
and that music. I especially like doing this with milongas. It's a pretty
exciting sensation. (I think I still put my heels down most of the time
even when I lean.)
Helaine
--The International School of Art in Umbria, Italy
06057 Montecastello di Vibio (PG), Italy
Tel / Fax +39-075-8780223 US Voicemail 212-386-2705
http://www.giotto.org/ email: treitman @giotto.org
Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 07:58:01 -0700
From: Richard deSousa <m1aport @PACBELL.NET>
Subject: Re: Tango Technique
Dear List:
I would like to make some slight clarifications to my original post below. The pressure by
the leader's left hand is intended to bend the right hand of the follower at the wrist rather
than pushing or pulling her entire arm sideways, forwards or backwards. Obviously the task
of the leader's right hand is more difficult since there is nothing to grasp firmly with. As
I watched the teacher demonstrate the technique, his right hand seemed to grasp the follower
under her left arm in the area around her left shoulder blade. All of my other tango teachers
previously have taught me to place my right hand on the follower's right shoulder blade.
My apologies if I confused anyone reading my original post; it was very late last night
when I composed it.
The teachers were great dancers with impeccable performance credentials, but I would venture
to say that I would not take another class from this couple since I felt their technique
violated some of the fundamental rules I was taught by other teachers.
Rich deSousa
Richard deSousa wrote:
> Dear List:
> I am a beginner (I started three months ago) and I had an interesting experience last Wednesday evening when I took a class from a couple from Argentina who shall remain anonymous. The male teacher explained to us that to lead a woman the leader should use his hands (very subtly) to manipulate the direction he wants her to go, i.e., slightly pulling her right hand outwards is suppose to tell her move her right leg
> outwards to the right, pushing her hand towards the line of dance is suppose to tell her to move her right leg back, and pulling her hand opposite to the line of dance is suppose to tell her to move her right leg forward; the leader's right hand is used similarly for leading the follower's left leg; by pulling her sideways, forwards, and backwards (this is more difficult since there is nothing to hold on to!!). If
> I have learned one thing about tango dancing from lessons I have taken these past three months, it would seem that this method violates some of the fundamental rules I was taught in leading the follower. Am I wrong? Any comments?
> Rich deSousa
Date: Mon, 19 Apr 1999 11:18:50 -0500
From: Aristotelis Grammatikakis <arigr @HUGO.SMFA.EDU>
Subject: Right woman's heel height
While taking care of my man's tango shoes I came up with something.
The tip of the shoes from the ball of the feet after all the dancing have
taking a slight turn up. That is because there are not dancer's shoes,
that is, not extremely flexible. What I did is, I took one shoe by its back
and pressed the tip flat on the floor, so the heel would be up. Then I
measured that height. It came to about two and a half to three inches.
>From that very scientific test, I conclude that the right heel height for
a woman is two and half to three inches.
:-)
A.
Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 11:47:21 -0500
From: Frank Williams <frank @INDY.BSBE.UMN.EDU>
Subject: Re: Tango Technique
Greetings friends,
Rich wrote:
> I have learned one thing about tango dancing from lessons I have taken these
past three months, it would seem that this method violates some of the
fundamental rules I was taught in leading the follower. Am I wrong? Any
comments?
I think we have to ask two basic questions: Is there a "wrong" way to dance
beautifully and should the fundamental techniques of tango be "standardized"?
It's probably been a year since the latter of these two questions was sent
through the tango-l grinder, and the consensus was that there should be no
absolute standards. People who dance using hands for "left rudder" and "right
rudder" should not be criticized as "wrong", but perhaps recognized as
"unique". However, if the dancers Rich described keep a good frame, then the
chest moves with these hands and in this case the argument may boil down to
semantics. Before Rich's clarification, I suspected a language problem and
imagined that the teacher's *discription* of what they're doing placed
incorrect emphasis on one element that is secondary to other fundamentals. Now
it sounds like "the rudder technique" is indeed uncommon. But I've had
teachers who, themselves, really don't use the techniques in the way that they
teach them. As for Rich's experience, at best, if the rest of the teachers'
frame is good then the hands may not interfere much!
Is there a wrong way to dance social Argentine tango beautifully? I think not.
We're always adjusting for different partners - their sizes, skill, tastes,
(need for a leaning post ;-)) etc. We always adjust for the floor quality, for
the number of bodies around us, for the particular music and the way it's
played. Some partners are quite concerned with technique, others are not. At
my practica I stress technique, with the goal of making it so automatic that
dancers will not worry about it at the milonga. [...not there yet! ;-)] On
the other hand, one of the BEST things about tango at the milonga is that each
partner and I are the ONLY ones whose opinions count on the subject of quality!
There's no checklist of compulsory elements - our success or failures are
judged by the feelings we achieve or fail to attain. While tolerating
diversity, there's still some value in consensus and I would say that the most
fundamental element in all dance, self control and balance, are indispensible.
People whose technique is radically different from others in their community
will not be easy for a partner to accomodate. For them, it's likely that their
dances will never be comfortable, the feelings will never flow, and the loss
will be their own.
Regards,
Frank in Minneapolis
--
______________________________________________________________
Frank G. Williams, Ph.D. University of Minnesota
frank @indy.bsbe.umn.edu Department of Neuroscience
frank @biosci.cbs.umn.edu 4-144 Jackson Hall
(612) 625-6441 (office) 321 Church Street SE.
(612) 624-4436 (lab) Minneapolis, MN 55455
Date: Sat, 24 Apr 1999 17:00:25 -0400
From: Jeffrey Blustein <blustein @AECOM.YU.EDU>
Subject: Ithaca tango
Does anyone have the dates for the Ithaca tango week this June? Thanks.
Jeffrey Blustein
End of TANGO-L Digest - 24 Apr 1999 to 25 Apr 1999
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