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Digest from 15 Apr 1999
to 16 Apr 1999
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Date: Fri, 16 Apr 1999 03:00:00 -0400
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Subject: TANGO-L Digest - 15 Apr 1999 to 16 Apr 1999
There are 15 messages totalling 623 lines in this issue.
Topics of the day:
1. "Tangoing" is great
2. Tango Burnout (4)
3. tango shoes: a case against Flabella (3)
4. Correction Fabians schedule
5. What makes a Tango shoe
6. Tango burnout
7. Who put gomina in my shoes?
8. tANGOSHOES-FLABELLA
9. Fabian Salas in Wash. DC
10. Asta Chen's Complaint about "Forever Tango" Video
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 03:23:29 +0000
From: Jane whisler <mcain @WOLFENET.COM>
Subject: "Tangoing" is great
I just needed to say that"Tangoing"was just in Seattle,and was quite a
breath of fresh air.It was such a relief to see these great dancers not
only master the more traditional,tango dramatics,but to let loose, while
in no way betraying the essence,in fact,for me capturing the real
interplay and fun ,all the things that tango can and should be.When I
hear "this one's different"I think,yeah,right.
This one really suprised me and left me excited all over about tango
wasnt sure I'd ever see something new at a tango performance.If this one
gets near you,grab it!
Jane Whisler
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 09:26:00 -0400
From: Chan Park <Chan.K.Park.1 @GSFC.NASA.GOV>
Subject: Re: Tango Burnout
>David Locke
>After nine months of almost daily classes, practicas, milongas, workshops
>and private lessons, after finding a group of very supportive friends, I'm
>at that plateau and I'm burning out. How did you get past this if it has
>happened to you?
>Walter M. (Tangringo) Kan wrote:
>
>Try this: Find a partner that will dance with you, and find an empty floor
>somewhere. Put on Quejas de Bandoneon, or Gallo Ciego, or Don Juan, or
>Recuerdos, or....(your choice)...... Embrace your partner, close your
>eyes, and let the music get inside you. You'll tango.
Dear David,
Sounds like it has been busy nine months for you. I understand your=
feelings because I had a similar experience when I started tangoing.=20
I think Walter's suggestion is right on target. May I add one more song to=
the music list? I would recommend Piazzolla's Oblivion, which I believe=
will make you calm down and sink into your inner feelings.=20
I think it is about time for you to listen to music within you, feel=
partner's heart beat, and let your feelings guide you rather than all the=
steps you have been dying to learn. Don't worry. They will come back to=
you later on. For now, if I were you I would take a "less is better" appr=
oach.
Hope this helps.
Tango, Tango, Tango
Chan Park
Baltimore-Washington Tango
http://www.geuni.com/baltimore_washington_tango
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 08:56:22 -0500
From: robin tara <rtara @MAINE.RR.COM>
Subject: Re: tango shoes: a case against Flabella
I have dealt with Flabella for years and although I have, at times
managed to get the shoes I wanted within a reasonable time, there have
also been times when the shoes never materialized. I also agree with
another writer that Susanna's shoes are quite elegant and that she tries
very hard to accomodate her customers.
I believe it's time to bring great tango shoes to the North American
tango dancers. For years it has been impossible to find shoes suitable
for tango in dance stores in the US. One can sometimes find street shoes
with the "look", but it takes a lot of searching.
I've decided to try to address the problem by working with a wonderful
factory in Uruguay. I've spent hours with them designing a small line of
beautiful shoes which are designed especially for tango dancers. They
will have the elegance of the Flabella and Fattomano designs combined
with some special features that will make them more comfortable and
durable. We are still in the sampling stage, but within a month or two
the shoes will become available in this country.
It's a big financial risk to be taking this step and I sure hope the
North American tango community is interested in buying shoes here. I'd
love to hear from tango dancers about what features and designs they
would be most interested in seeing in a tango shoe.
All the best,
Robin Tara
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 10:06:58 +0100
From: Manuel Patino <manuelp @MINDSPRING.COM>
Subject: Re: Correction Fabians schedule
Please note the correction of time for Fabian's second workshop in Atlanta
on Sunday May 2. I erroneously typed the same time for both classes
>5. Sunday May 2, 12:30-2:00 p.m.
>Sacadas
>
>6. Sunday May 2, 2:30 - 4:00 p.m.
>Jumps & performance moves
Thank you
.
Manuel Patino
www.tango-rio.com
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 10:07:13 -0400
From: Jacques Gauthier <salsa-m @LYCOSMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: tango shoes: a case against Flabella
> I believe it's time to bring great tango shoes to the North American
> tango dancers. For years it has been impossible to find shoes
> suitable for tango in dance stores in the US. One can sometimes find
street
> shoes with the "look", but it takes a lot of searching.
Forgive me, but what is the big deal about these specific shoes ?
Is there something special about the sole ? Is it more like the
eagerness of people of the swing scene to wear two-tone
(Bleyer's) shoes ?
The Academie de Tango Argentin in Montreal has started selling
Flabella shoes. (I haven't seen them yet).
Jacques G.
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 09:45:20 -0500
From: robin tara <rtara @MAINE.RR.COM>
Subject: What makes a Tango shoe
Jacques asks:
<Forgive me, but what is the big deal about these specific shoes ?
Is there something special about the sole ? Is it more like the
eagerness of people of the swing scene to wear two-tone
(Bleyer's) shoes ?>
Well, Jacques,
That's not an easy question to answer. Yes, I suppose it is like the
swing people's eagerness to wear Bleyer shoes. But, after talking to
some swing people I discovered that there were some pretty good reasons
why they like those shoes. Comfort, lightness, a sole that takes impact
and "the look".
I believe it's the same for tango shoes. People have chosen Flabella
shoes for years. Why? Well, first, his shoes have "the look" - it's a
look that's elegant and is also, in Eduardo's words, "muy sexy" . This
look is achieved in the design and shape of the shoe and the curve of
the arch. There's also the design and placement of the heel which
allows a woman to feel very secure while also having the sleekness we
associate with a tango look. The shoes should have a steel arch support
which gives more support and durability. (Some Flabella shoes have this,
others don't) And yes, there is something about the sole - unlike the
trypical ballroom shoe with the split (soft) leather sole, tango shoes
have a hard, shiny sole that enables the dancer to swivel more easily
and be more responsive. It's slickness also requires the dancer to be in
perfect balance at all times, and we all know how important this is to
good tango dancing.
Many women I have talked to want the extra padding in the metatarsal
area that makes some ballroom shoes so comfortable. This feature will be
built into my new line.
Most of these issues are pertinent especially to women's shoes. Men's
shoes are another story. Men's ballroom shoes are very soft and pliant.
They offer little support. Men's street shoes tend to be a bit clunky
and when dancing with a man in a heavy shoe women are very, very careful
because they imaging that big, heavy hoof crushing theirs. A good man's
tango shoe is a crossbreed. It has the flexibility, lightness and
graceful look of a ballroom shoe and the support and durability of a
street shoe.
Another thing about Eduardo, I believe people choose Flabella because
he's VERY centrally located - a block from Confiteria Ideal and their
afternoon tea dances which, it seems, everyone attends at least once
during their visit to Buenos Aires. I'm convinced that his location is
the biggest asset to his business because he sure knows nothing about
customer service.
Robin T.
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 10:29:00 -0400
From: Michael Ditkoff <Michael.B.Ditkoff @USDOJ.GOV>
Subject: Re: Tango Burnout
Message authorized by:
: dlocke @BINDVIEW.COM_at_inetgw2 at wtgate
David:
Based on your message, I think you're drowning in tango. Like
most tangueros, we want to learn it NOW.
Argentine Tango is the most difficult dance I know. With one
lesson you can dance waltz poorly. It takes many lessons to
dance tango poorly.
When I started, I was jealous of men who could lead women in
difficult figures. I have since found out that dancing
difficult figures IS NOT important to women (or at least the
ones I talk to and dance with.) They want a partner who -
- has a firm but gentle lead
- can keep time
- can execute correctly without force
I suggest you slow down and concentrate on --
Walking
Going to the cross
Front and back ochos on both sides
After you get the basics down, especially frame, the rest will
come easier. There's a lot to remember in tango compared to
ballroom, which you didn't indicate if you dance. A man has to
remember (1) TOE first, not heel and (2) which foot the woman
is standing on to know if he is on parallel or cross feet and
(3) use contra body motion so that frame is maintained.
Women are more impressed with technique and execution than
dancing difficult figures.
If I'm wrong, I can expect to be flamed by women so I'm really
sticking my neck out.
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 10:59:27 -0400
From: Robinne Gray <rlg2 @CORNELL.EDU>
Subject: Tango burnout
>>How did you get past this if it has happened to you?
Having had some recent personal experience with burnout (especially after
intense preparation for a big show) I feel compelled to add my thoughts in
response to David's query.
Tango can easily fit an addictive model: one goes out and occasionally has
peak experiences that, like the addict's high, only make one crave it the
more. And life can be subsumed in a huge quest for the next high, which is
why people pour so much time, energy, money into the habit. This works
perfectly well for some people, and that's great.
Even in the small town of Ithaca, it's possible to do something
tango-related "almost daily." For me, that level of participation began to
feel one-dimensional and limiting--with my days full of work and my
evenings full of tango, there was time for nothing else. When tango
started ceasing to be FUN, that was the #1 warning sign for burnout.
Here are a few informal suggestions based on what has worked for me:
--See your tango friends *outside* of tango events. For example, I go out
for wine & dessert or pizza & movies with my close tanguera friends. Fear
not, there is still tango content, in the form of gossip about the relative
merits of tangueros we know, or talk about dance shoes....
--Dance outside your own community. This is a great way to get a "booster
shot" and regain some of one's original enthusiasm. I hadn't traveled in
awhile, and my recent trip to NYC put me back in touch with the freshness
and joy of it all. A big public thanks to the men of New York! :-)
--Pace yourself. You don't have to give in to the obsessive-compulsive
need to do EVERY class, practica, milonga, special event. (Sacrilege! I
hear you thinking.) Nothing cataclysmic will happen if you don't, though
when you're in the middle of it this can seem hard to believe.
Awhile back, someone posted a message about asking the old milongueros
(I'm paraphrasing from memory): "If tango was such an important part of
your life, why did you stop doing it for 30 years?" And the answer was,
well, we were busy working and raising our families and otherwise living
life.
An avid skier I know told me there's a saying, "You learn to ski in the
summertime," suggesting that there is some benefit to taking a break and
letting the learning sink in, instead of workingworkingworking all the time.
--Be selective; go for quality, not quantity.
--To avoid rusting, do something else with your body. :) This could be
other forms of social dance, or sports if you're athletically inclined, or
whatever. (Whatever is a good bet.) I'm interested in exploring some
complementary disciplines that might help me tune into different things &
thus inform my tango, such as yoga or ballet or the Alexander Technique, or
any discipline that highlights the body/mind connection.
Good luck with finding your way back.
--Robinne
Ithaca, NY
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 11:50:25 -0500
From: David Locke <dlocke @BINDVIEW.COM>
Subject: Re: Tango Burnout
I want to thank everyone for their advice about handling burnout and
plateaus. The problem is not just mine alone, but was and is shared by some
of the people who responed to my post.
The advice ranged from slowing down, to quiting instruction, to stopping
completely, to being selective with whom and when I dance, to focus on the
walk rather than figures, to finding new places and partners, to going to
BAs, and to finding new interests.
The responses about plateaus seemed to indicate that they should be worked
through. So I left trying to differenciate the two, since the advice here is
contradictory.
I will slow down, drop instruction, only dance meaningful dances, find new
places and partners to dance with, and find some outside interests. I can't
really go to BA anytime soon. I will go cold turkey only if these steps
don't work.
Thanks.
David Locke
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 13:36:27 -0700
From: Planet Tango <tangoman @HOOKED.NET>
Subject: Who put gomina in my shoes?
> I've spent hours with them designing a small line of
>beautiful shoes which are designed especially for tango dancers.
>Forgive me, but what is the big deal about these specific shoes ?
>Is there something special about the sole ? Is it more like the
>eagerness of people of the swing scene to wear two-tone
>(Bleyer's) shoes ?
I was reading a cute little collection of Latin American proverbs that
somebody gave me as a present and I came across two that seem to address
some of the questioning about "tango shoes" and "gomina."
"A monk is not because of his habit."
"Dress the monkey in silk and it is still a monkey."
I remember about three years ago when I found three of the female stars of
Forever Tango merrily shopping for shoes to wear on stage at a Payless Shoe
Store in San Francisco.
That's was a time when I too believed that the biggest the star or the
greatest the dancer, the classiest and sexiest and most beautiful shoes
needed to be worn.
One of the ladies reminded me about the hundreds and hundreds of
exceptionally good women dancers in the milongas of Buenos Aires and if I
had ever paid attention to the shoes they were wearing.
I think that we buy "tangoware" mostly on whims of vanity and a desire to
"belong," or to make statement.
One of my favorites moments is towards the end of a milonga when I walk onto
some dear friends and as they finished changing their "tango shoes," I ask
them to dance. Their looks of disbelief and their "automatic" disclaimer
about "no longer having their 'tango shoes' on," change in three minutes to
a confident smile, a warm hug, a sweet kiss and a soulful feeling of having
danced an unexpected tango for joy as a civilian.
On the matter of Eduardo, el chanta de Flabella, I'm reminded about some
people who show up at work with bruises inflicted by their soulmates and
when asked why do they stay in such an abusive relationship, they answer,
"because I love him/her/it."
Eduardo has survived in business because of the steady flock that organized
tours bring to him. Even then, some tourists don't get what they want.
I had the misfortune to meet, deal and swear at Eduardo during a year and a
half of trying to do business with him, that began in May 1997.
I resorted to all kinds of methods to get the shoes to the USA, including
enlisting the favors of friends, who no longer are friends because they got
pissed off at the way El chanta treats customers and friends.
When people who had trusted my judgment began to question whatever happened
to shoes ordered and paid for "a year ago," I cut my loses, refunded their
money and gave up trying to make excuses for Eduardo's unethical and amoral
behavior.
I'm looking forward to shake his hands...
and everything attached to it, next month. ;-)
Got to go because my "gomina" shipment just arrived. :-)
TangoMan
P.S. Chanta (as in, to act like a chanta, or to be a chanta): (lunfardism)
to avoid doing a job; to cause discouragement, depression, dejection, dismay
and moral defeat.
Thank you for visiting Planet Tango at,
http://www.hooked.net/~tangoman/
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 18:36:01 EDT
From: Frank Sasson <FRSASSON @AOL.COM>
Subject: Re: tango shoes: a case against Flabella
Hello List:
I wouldn't order another pair of Flabella shoes, even if I had to dance
barefoot.
I have had the worse experience with possibly the poorest quality non-fitting
shoes, even after I sent them a full drawing of my feet and measurements
drawn by an architect friend of mine.
However, I found some magnificent leather shoes with 100% leather soles and
rubber heels, made in India. - I just went through the whole Tango Congress
of Miami Beach with 2 pairs of them (which I changed at noon and again at
8PM) and my feet only hurt the last day, even though I danced constantly for
about 10 to 11 hours per day from Monday to Friday, plus the first Sunday
Evening Milonga and the grand ball on on the last Saturday night.
I paid a grand total of $60.00 a pair (Mens Shoes only). I asked the guy
about shipping and he said he would charge about $5.00 in the USA and $13.00
if it is abroad.
Only color available is BLACK
I am not in the business of selling shoes, but I will give the information of
where to order them, as a favor to any tanguero who needs shoes, and mainly
those who have sore feet from wearing Flabella shoes.
They do come in EEE for those of you with wide feet.
By the way they take about 3/4 weeks to arrive.
Frank Sasson
FRSasson @AOL.com
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 19:28:56 EDT
From: Daniel Lapadula <DaniTango @AOL.COM>
Subject: tANGOSHOES-FLABELLA
Hi list.....This maybe my second time been part of a "Discussion."
I find sometimes, so silly the topics that the list discuss.
But on behalf of a very nice person and a personal friend of mine I have to
be in this particular one.
As a professional Dancer I am in need of the best shoes in the market,
because my feet are my talent and my currier depends on them.
In Buenos Aires (even wen we get mad with Eduardo)(many times) thousand of
times)we....the Dancers recognize that the shoes make by Flabella(Eduardo),
perhaps) Are the best ones for the purpose of Dancing.
There are not even equal quality in the others shoemakers...!!!
Please understand that this is my personal point of view, share with many
others professionals.
Eduardo is a Lair. Irresponsible and so many other thinks...but,he is a
master making shoes for Tango Dancers (Go by the many pro or Shows he had
provide)
I will accept a wrong opinion (and I said wrong.....)about Eduardo him self.
But, no. To the type of work he did for the Tango Community.
Be more respectful wen you don't now what are you talking about. Because you
went to BA one time (or even not one) and You have a problem with your shoes
of Flabella(maybe are your feet, and you don't now??????)you are not entitle
to write to others ones
for your frustration.
I am sorry to be like this ,,, But...use the tango-L to positives thinks.
We, the Tango Dancers are proud to have Flabella doing Tango Shoes to the all
world. Daniel Lapadula
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 17:43:35 -0700
From: Kathleen Bober <kbober @FLASH.NET>
Subject: Re: Tango Burnout
David,
Burnout can happen for various reasons. I experienced something similar as
much as I hate to admit it, but of course I also didn't want to give up my
friends and the accomplishments I had made in tango. If you feel you must
take a break you might try what I did. I started taking T'ai Chi lessons.
This allowed me to continue focusing on my balance and coordination and
made a big difference in my dancing. (I also made new friends!)
Kathleen
> From: David Locke <dlocke @BINDVIEW.COM>
> To:
> Subject: Tango Burnout
> Date: Wednesday, April 14, 1999 1:25 PM
>
> After nine months of almost daily classes, practicas, milongas, workshops
> and private lessons, after finding a group of very supportive friends,
I'm
> at that plateau and I'm burning out. How did you get past this if it has
> happened to you?
>
> A tango buddy of mine sugested going cold turkey for a while, but I
really
> don't want to find something else to fill my calendar. I have to many
tango
> freinds to just disappear. Any help will be greatly appreciated. Thanks.
>
> David Locke
>
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 20:54:43 -0400
From: Melinda Bates <tangerauna @EARTHLINK.NET>
Subject: Fabian Salas in Wash. DC
Hello list!
Fabian Salas will be teaching in Washington DC in the studio of Betty Runge:
April 22 to 27
Telephone 202-363-9238
He will teach workshops on singular elements and is available for private
lessons for couples only. Call Betty to schedule.
Date: Thu, 15 Apr 1999 23:38:49 +0000
From: Mark Celaya <mark-joan-tango @JUNO.COM>
Subject: Asta Chen's Complaint about "Forever Tango" Video
Asta Chen claims we did not respond to her complaint
of April 12, about the approx. running time of 1 hour
instead of the original information we had been given
re. a 2 hr. running time for the "Forever Tango" video,
produced and released by Luis Bravo.
We did correct that misinformation on TangoL the very next
day, April 13.
Perhaps Ms./Mr. Chen did not catch that particular posting.
If that is the case, Ms./Mr. Chen, please review your old,
obviously, unread postings of TangoL to see our
general message to all readers and interested parties
re. the corrected running time of the video.
By the way, Ms./Mr. Chen did let us know that he/she liked
the video very much, "The dance is really fantastic..."
Just for the record, the video contains "exerpts" from the
Original Broadway Cast production, edited by Luis Bravo
at his discretion.
We had nothing to do with the production of this video,
we present it to you as Mr. Bravo saw fit to create it.
Perhaps, we could all prevail upon the powers that be of
"Forever Tango" to release more of our favorite dance
numbers and performers in a follow-up video.
In the meantime, let's all enjoy what they have worked
so hard to produce thus far!
Con Abrazos,
Mark & Joan
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End of TANGO-L Digest - 15 Apr 1999 to 16 Apr 1999
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